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Abby1964
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 Posted: Wed Dec 21st, 2011 10:54 pm

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Actually I grew up in Virginia just migrated to Texas to avoid the damp cold of the eastern seaboard.  I'm not really a fan of Chili Mac.  I agree that while her recipe may be cheap and easy it really is not appealing to me.  I do like cooking from scratch when possible and never really got into sloppy joe's.  I prefer a hamburger made with the fixings in the burger.  I will add in diced onions, tomato and pressed garlic etc before cooking the burger.

I mean for what she was cooking, she might as well just open a can of Manwich and be done with it.  That is really too much mustard and too much ketchup.



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Be_You_
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 Posted: Wed Dec 21st, 2011 11:12 pm

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For a short time I went to a school where sloppy joes were served as a weekly item on the menu. The downside of it was that - unlike in the case of a burger whose mass is somewhat of a solid - any "items" that made it past the grinding elements in the meat plant remained relatively distinct and clearly recognizable amongst the glop.

In any case, I believe the sloppy joes my mom made incorporated a better grade of meat, and certainly there were freshly diced bits of onion, bell peper and celery in it too. (I'm quite sure DFG linked the video out of some other impulse than trying to convert us to that menu! DFG? Am I not right?)

I'm mostly vegetarian now and I find Vegeburger - a kind of grain and bean or chickpea mix to which you add boiling water, let sit for 15 minutes, and then form into patties and either bake or fry - is quite as tasty and satisfying as meat-based burgers when done-up with all the fixings and maybe a bit of mayo added on top.

 

Last edited on Wed Dec 21st, 2011 11:16 pm by Be_You_

Abby1964
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 Posted: Thu Dec 22nd, 2011 02:21 am

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I'm just too much of a carnivore to do without meat.



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Angel
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 Posted: Thu Dec 22nd, 2011 11:46 am

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Me too. A can of manwich and some hamburger...there ya go...sloppy joes.



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Be_You_
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 Posted: Thu Dec 22nd, 2011 09:43 pm

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Are Humans Carnivores, Omnivores or Herbivores?

http://letthemeatmeat.com/post/430287173/are-humans-carnivores-omnivores-or-herbivores

 

Last edited on Thu Dec 22nd, 2011 09:44 pm by Be_You_

Kaden
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 Posted: Tue Dec 27th, 2011 04:19 am

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Abby1964 wrote: Actually I grew up in Virginia just migrated to Texas to avoid the damp cold of the eastern seaboard.  I'm not really a fan of Chili Mac.  I agree that while her recipe may be cheap and easy it really is not appealing to me.  I do like cooking from scratch when possible and never really got into sloppy joe's.  I prefer a hamburger made with the fixings in the burger.  I will add in diced onions, tomato and pressed garlic etc before cooking the burger.

I mean for what she was cooking, she might as well just open a can of Manwich and be done with it.  That is really too much mustard and too much ketchup.
I like the idea of cheap, simple food but combining that much ketchup and mustard makes for a rather disturbing looking concoction.

I like how the woman in the video said, "Ketchup... for tomato without the tomato." It's red, so that counts, right?



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Dragonflygurl
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 Posted: Tue Dec 27th, 2011 06:16 pm

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Kaden wrote: Abby1964 wrote: Actually I grew up in Virginia just migrated to Texas to avoid the damp cold of the eastern seaboard.  I'm not really a fan of Chili Mac.  I agree that while her recipe may be cheap and easy it really is not appealing to me.  I do like cooking from scratch when possible and never really got into sloppy joe's.  I prefer a hamburger made with the fixings in the burger.  I will add in diced onions, tomato and pressed garlic etc before cooking the burger.

I mean for what she was cooking, she might as well just open a can of Manwich and be done with it.  That is really too much mustard and too much ketchup.
I like the idea of cheap, simple food but combining that much ketchup and mustard makes for a rather disturbing looking concoction.

I like how the woman in the video said, "Ketchup... for tomato without the tomato." It's red, so that counts, right?
That's what I mean, all the mustard and tom made it look like poo.  I wouldn't touch it with a barge pool.  If that were me, I'd use either fresh pureed tomatos or a tin of tomatoes.  I'd put it in a whole meal bun too.  I was a veggie for years but I've started to eat a little meat now, but mostly chickhen.  Use to love fish but with all the radiation in the sea, I'll  not touch it ever again.  Damn I really loved sushi  too.

Be_You_
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 Posted: Tue Dec 27th, 2011 09:03 pm

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Dragonflygurl wrote: Kaden wrote: Abby1964 wrote: Actually I grew up in Virginia just migrated to Texas to avoid the damp cold of the eastern seaboard.  I'm not really a fan of Chili Mac.  I agree that while her recipe may be cheap and easy it really is not appealing to me.  I do like cooking from scratch when possible and never really got into sloppy joe's.  I prefer a hamburger made with the fixings in the burger.  I will add in diced onions, tomato and pressed garlic etc before cooking the burger.

I mean for what she was cooking, she might as well just open a can of Manwich and be done with it.  That is really too much mustard and too much ketchup.
I like the idea of cheap, simple food but combining that much ketchup and mustard makes for a rather disturbing looking concoction.

I like how the woman in the video said, "Ketchup... for tomato without the tomato." It's red, so that counts, right?
That's what I mean, all the mustard and tom made it look like poo.  I wouldn't touch it with a barge pool.  If that were me, I'd use either fresh pureed tomatos or a tin of tomatoes.  I'd put it in a whole meal bun too.  I was a veggie for years but I've started to eat a little meat now, but mostly chickhen.  Use to love fish but with all the radiation in the sea, I'll  not touch it ever again.  Damn I really loved sushi  too.


Everybody is allowed to eat whatever they want (of course!) but feeding all that salt and sugar to your children along with fat-laden white-bread bun does seem to border on the criminal child endangerment.

DFG, perhaps despite the radiation danger now added to the mercury fears of yore, seafood products are still a viable choice - as long as they are produced responsibly through farming.

One non-vegetarian item I would hat to give up is the finely crafted tempura shrimp roll: warm, crunchy and buttery on the inside with a cool and moist surrounding... slathered in wasabi and soy sauce and washed down with Asahi Dry! Yum.

As for my other sushi favorite - saba nigiri - maybe I really should cut that out even though mackerel has been one of the more sustainable varieties of wild-caught seafood.

Abby1964
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 Posted: Tue Dec 27th, 2011 11:24 pm

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Kaden wrote: Abby1964 wrote: Actually I grew up in Virginia just migrated to Texas to avoid the damp cold of the eastern seaboard.  I'm not really a fan of Chili Mac.  I agree that while her recipe may be cheap and easy it really is not appealing to me.  I do like cooking from scratch when possible and never really got into sloppy joe's.  I prefer a hamburger made with the fixings in the burger.  I will add in diced onions, tomato and pressed garlic etc before cooking the burger.

I mean for what she was cooking, she might as well just open a can of Manwich and be done with it.  That is really too much mustard and too much ketchup.
I like the idea of cheap, simple food but combining that much ketchup and mustard makes for a rather disturbing looking concoction.

I like how the woman in the video said, "Ketchup... for tomato without the tomato." It's red, so that counts, right?
With all the 'processing' and genetic modifications with the foods we eat, the salt' sugar and white bread may be a moot point.  But we can still try to lessen the damage.  Pretty much everything that we eat is 'contaminated.  We're all dining on Monsanto Franken-foods, whether we realize it or not.




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 Posted: Wed Dec 28th, 2011 03:37 am

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Abby1964 wrote: Kaden wrote: Abby1964 wrote: Actually I grew up in Virginia just migrated to Texas to avoid the damp cold of the eastern seaboard.  I'm not really a fan of Chili Mac.  I agree that while her recipe may be cheap and easy it really is not appealing to me.  I do like cooking from scratch when possible and never really got into sloppy joe's.  I prefer a hamburger made with the fixings in the burger.  I will add in diced onions, tomato and pressed garlic etc before cooking the burger.

I mean for what she was cooking, she might as well just open a can of Manwich and be done with it.  That is really too much mustard and too much ketchup.
I like the idea of cheap, simple food but combining that much ketchup and mustard makes for a rather disturbing looking concoction.

I like how the woman in the video said, "Ketchup... for tomato without the tomato." It's red, so that counts, right?
With all the 'processing' and genetic modifications with the foods we eat, the salt' sugar and white bread may be a moot point.  But we can still try to lessen the damage.  Pretty much everything that we eat is 'contaminated.  We're all dining on Monsanto Franken-foods, whether we realize it or not.


True, but that's no reason to ingest goo on a bun. That stuff looked worse than what comes out of Lexx's food tube. :c030a:



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Abby1964
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 Posted: Wed Dec 28th, 2011 08:52 pm

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That was why I said 'lessen the damage'. Even "Organic" foods are contaminated but some people feel good about paying for that word on stuff.



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 Posted: Fri Dec 30th, 2011 05:15 am

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Some organic stuff is more important to buy than others - and there's three major considerations involved in making the choice of where to spend your money: the reduction of pesticide consumption, reduction of GMO consumption, and improvment of environmental conditions associated with farming.

Some produce is more likely to transmit pesticide contamination than others. According to the Environmental Working Group, items which should be priorities for organic purchase are apples, strawberries, peaches, celery, spinach: there's far less "bang for the buck" in spending extra for organic onions, sweet corn, pineapples, avocado, and asparagus.

(Full list: http://www.ewg.org/foodnews/summary/)
   
As for GMO stuff, I object to it as much on the basis of corporate control over the food supply and the patenting of genes and organisms which are the product of generations of old-school selective breeding than on health concerns.

The fact that animal genes may be grafted onto plant possibly triggering allergies or creating other unknown hazards is almost secondary, but it is notable that the FDA tried to make the national organic standard encompass GMO crops until widespread and vocal outrage put a stop to it. I don't think GMO crops count as organic within the European Union contries.

The GMO concern merges over into the environmental concern too, because some of these crops are pernicious and threaten (at least) to contaminate non-GMO crops through gene drift... AND since many of the crops - like "roundup ready" - are actually genetically enhanced so as to withstand higher pesticide concentrations, such crops are a hazard to consumers and farmers alike.

Dairy and meat products mostly fall into the last category in terms of the benefits from buying organic. The organic and non-organic products aren't that different, but the differences in how they are produced may represent a big difference for the environment, since organic milk must be produce using organic feed which is free of pesticides. You are supporting organic agriculture on a wide basis when you purchase it.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14458802/ns/health-diet_and_nutrition/t/organic-milk-are-benefits-worth-cost/

Abby1964
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 Posted: Fri Dec 30th, 2011 02:12 pm

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My problem with 'organic' is the same as my problem with 'green'. Both have become marketing buzzwords used to charge higher prices for products that may be just as if not more damaging than non-organic or non-green products. A chicken farmer may be feeding those chicken 'organic feed'. The grain supplier does not use pesticides so he can call it 'organic' despite the fact that the feed itself is grown from genetically altered seed. The average person in the store sees the word 'organic' and makes the assumption that it is 'better' than eggs from a hen that has been fed grain grown from seed that has not be genetically altered but was treated with pesticides as it was cultivated.

The same thing with 'green'. Take those spiral light bulbs that last so long. They have a much higher concentration of Mercury than regular bulbs but are marketed as being 'green' because they save money. Nice short term benefit but when those bulbs burn out, how many people are actually going to get in their car and drive miles to a disposal facility to turn in this hazardous material? Most will toss them in the trash and these bulbs will end up in a landfill where they will be shattered by bulldozers and and steam rollers allowing all that mercury to leach into the soil. Now what will be the long term effect of eating organic eggs contaminated by chickens eating genetically altered grains?



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 Posted: Fri Dec 30th, 2011 11:29 pm

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Abby, as much as I value your concerns, I think the situation isn't quite as dire as you suggest.

In regard to consuming organic chicken, eggs, and most meat there isn't much value on the personal level anyway, but I don't think the organic stuff tends to be contaminated; and animals must be fed organic grain in order for the products to be certified as organic.

While cross contamination of crops has indeed been shown to occur, as far as I know it always goes badly for the farmer: he ends up owing Monsanto or whomever money for the crops he didn't want to grow - and he loses his organic certification.

I don't think it is any easier for an organic feed producer (such as
http://www.modestomilling.com/) to get certified than it is for organic people-food producers. And though I'm willing to concede there may be some cheating or errors involved, I believe there's too much at stake for the certification companies and farmers to assume they are all cheating.

As for your concern about the lightbulbs, that's something I whole-heartedly agree with. The CFLs should have never been mandated and in fact I think they ought to be outlawed unless a prepaid mailer for recycling is included with each one. Though many stores that sell them also take them back, I know many end up in landfills as you say.

Additionally, I think the claims for the CFLs regarding energy savings have been somewhat overstated: because the U.S. has a temperate climate and lighting is generally used mostly at night when it is coolest - the precise times that homes are most likely to need heating - the supposedly "parasitic" heat loss from incandescent lighting isn't lost at all for the most part.

Fortunately, new energy efficient, long-lasting, and attractive low-voltage LED lighting - though still quite expensive - has finally become available. I've installed some of these and they are very bright, very pleasant, and turn on instantly. They are also far more compact than any other type of lighting.

I sincerely hope the prices soon come down for the LEDs and they completely supplant the ugly flourescent bulbs. (It'd be nice if they weren't all made in China too: General Electric used to - after all - produce all the incandescent light bulbs we ever needed right here domestically.)

BU

Last edited on Fri Dec 30th, 2011 11:40 pm by Be_You_

Abby1964
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 Posted: Sat Dec 31st, 2011 02:54 am

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The problem is that we don't have any idea what long term damage is being done by ingesting genetically modified foods. There hasn't been enough time to determine the effects. By the time the effects become apparent we could be in a situation where the damage cannot be reversed.

In fact the only testing done on genetically modified foods was the Flavr Saver tomato. That approval stands as an 'approval' for all GMO products. Take the time to look into the controversy over the testing process and check these documents http://www.biointegrity.org/list.html

We don't know what these Frankenfoods are doing to us.



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